Nothing lasts enough to be known as something

Transcript from 2022-6-09-pm.mp3 (1m) in BKK by Chanti, edited by Alberto.

Q: We learn that realities like citta and cetasikas arise and fall away, and because of that there are nimittas. 

A Sujin: Yes. That’s why when we talk about seeing, there is nimitta of seeing, but in truth there is not only one single moment of seeing. And how many colours are seen now?

Q: I think there are many colours.

A Sujin: Yes. And when there is one colour, - still - it is nimitta of one colour. So, when there are many colours appearing, it means that there are so many, uncountable moments of seeing. Different colours, one colour at a time. 

Q: Ajahn, there are many moments, like hearing and seeing, so why does the nimitta become for example the leaf, we see a leaf? 

A Sujin: We are going from moment to moment, understanding. Now, at the moment of seeing, there are so many different colours, mimitta of each colour and nimitta of many colours, conditions the idea of something with shape and form. If there is only darkness seen, can there be something? (No). But there are so many colours, that is why it conditions the nimitta, shape and form to be known as concept. (pointing) It makes known to be this and it makes known to be that, and it makes known to be this [other] too… different colours. 

Q: For example if there are ten moments of seeing, there are ten colours, is it right?

A Sujin: How many colours are there now? More than ten? 

Q: I think there are many.

A Sujin: That's it. How fast it is. So, not just thinking "many moments are experienced", how about just one moment? How subtle it is. 

Q: So I think visible object is only the colour, not like yellow, white or green.

A Sujin: It does not matter, do we have to paint it, for that which is seen to have different colours? And even different colours are conditioned, try to change the colour of the leaf... impossible. 

Q: Do the different colours come from one moment or from different moments?

A Sujin: No. Even that which is seen, or colour, falls away: as soon as it has arisen it falls away, but slower than the citta, than the experiencing. Even at the moment of touching, it seems like hardness is there, but even so the hardness there arises and falls away, nothing lasts enough to be known as something. 

Q2: To clarify: at each moment of seeing, there is only one single colour or single visible object? 

A Sujin: Can there be two colours to be seen in one moment?

Q2: Ok I think I have the wrong understanding. What is the colour we are mentioning? 

A Sujin: Visible object.

Q2: So, only one single visible object at one moment. 

A Sujin: Very short.

Q2: But colour stands for visible object.

A Sujin: No matter if you call it colour or visible object: that which is seen. Don't use any word, what is seen now it's *a* reality. So, we just use some words to explain the difference between seeing and hearing. What is there at the moment of [color/visible object] being seen? What is there at the moment of [sound] being heard? We can use different words in a different languages, for that. It is seen now, no matter what you call it.

Q2: But now it's the leaf [seen].

A Sujin: Not the leaf, if we don’t use any word at all, this moment, is there seeing? Forget about the word, just the meaning, is there seeing? And is there what-is-seen? No matter what you call it, there must be that which is seen, use any word in Vietnamese or in Thai or English, we just mean the same thing: that which is seen. Now, is there anything seen? We're talking about that, which only seeing sees, only seeing can see. The other reality cannot see at all, just that which arises to see. Otherwise everything would be in darkness. 

[…]

If there was no seeing now, it would be impossible to talk about seeing, and that which is seen, but since there is seeing right now....

Q2: Seeing appears now. And hearing. Hearing appears now. … And seeing. 

A. Sujin: So, no doubt, but no understanding of the truth [that] the seeing is conditioned to arise just to see and there is no one at all, so it's "I", "I see".

Q3: Ajahn, what can make visible objects different?

A Sujin: Can you? (No) Can anyone? It arises and falls away before anyone can do anything at all, no time. 

Q3: Why can we see some visible object as different? 

A Sujin: Because it is different. What is seen is different. It's not that you think it's different from the other, but that which is seen is different from moment to moment. 

[...]

And what did Buddha say about this truth? Anattā, all dhammas are anattā, but they're atta for those who do not understand the truth. Until all are anattā, that is the Teachings of the absolute truth. No you, no me. No thing. Do you have to make it "no me"? Or it's no-me, it's not me. That is the difference between ignorance and understanding.

Q3: Can you explain more about the four primary/mahabhūta rūpas?

A Sujin: Touch the water and [then] the stone: mahabhūta rūpas, but different degrees of softness, hardness, heat and cold, conditioning different colour, different hardness, softness, taste, everything. 

There are the four primary rūpas, mahabhūta rūpas and there are another four rūpas arising together. Without mahabhūta rūpas can there be that which is seen? Without mahabhūta rūpas can there be sound? Without mahabhūta rūpas can there be smell? Without mahabhūta rūpas can there be taste?

So we just live in the world of seeing, hearing, smelling, tasting, touching - from moment to moment gone, never lasts. And these are all sankharas [which] are anicca, dukkha and all dhammas are anattā. 

That is the beginning of understanding the words of the Buddha, from word to word: dhammas, anattā. Sankhara (conditioned) dhammas: anicca, not permanent and anattā, all dhammas are anattā, all conditioned (sankhara) dhammas are anattā. And only that which is not conditioned [to arise is not anicca but] it's also anattā, all dhammas, includes everything: is the sun and the moon anattā?

Q3: It is a concept, so it is not anattā.

A Sujin: Really? Or it is anattā, but no one knows that it is anattā. But it can be understood, the sun: only that which is seen and we name it the sun, but it is only that which is seen. Just like that glass.