Dhamma: as soon as it has arisen is gone: no conditions for it to last
Dhamma discussion with Ajahn Sujin on Zoom on Sat Aug 30th 2025. (Part 4/4)
The source or the base for that taste - can the fruit be sweet?
[Prakash] Ajahn, what's the difference between sankhara-dhammas?
[A. Sujin] Just the word, or it's a reality? So, we have the word just to represent a reality, without the word, who knows what is meant, this or that, hot or hard; that's why we have the word to represent what reality we are talking about. So now, regarding your question - we'll start again - about dhamma; we don't talk about that which is not real, we just talk about the truth, the reality, the ultimate reality. We take this for table, but at moment of touching, it's hard - no table.
So, we learn to understand the reality which nobody can change at all; the seeing is a reality, sankhara-dhamma, because it cannot arise by itself or by anyone, but it can only arise by its proper conditions; and sankhara-dhamma, no matter it's seeing or hearing, there must be what is there together to condition its arising. So now, remember that dhamma is a reality, but only one reality cannot arise alone by itself, it has other realities arising together, supporting or conditioning each other; without citta, cetasikas cannot arise, but citta is not cetasika, and without cetasikas, citta cannot arise.
So, whatever arises has its conditions or other realities arising together; have firm confidence on this, firmer - never change. So, at moment of taste arising, there must be hardness or softness too, how could there be just that taste, sweetness, how come? That's why we take that the fruit to be so sweet, the fruit, see, and the sweetness; the apple is sweet, while the sauce is not sweet, there must be the source or the base or that which is there to condition such taste; can there be just the taste, without that apple or papaya? So, even taste cannot arise alone, but we don't know what conditions taste, until we learn, little by little - what are the main or the primary rupas? Without hardness, can there be taste, can there be sweetness, bitterness, or what is there as taste? It cannot arise alone.
Understanding when and where and what the truth is
Learn little by little, to have confidence of the truth, of dhamma first; all are dhammas, but all dhammas are not known yet; but whatever is real is real, but what the reality is, the truth of that reality, is not known yet. So, we study Dhamma to understand more and more about just one reality. What arises to experience the object, or cannot experience the object, that is the beginning. And then, how many different kinds of that which arises and experience the object? Two different kinds, one experience directly, as the chief, and the other also share or experience the same object, because they arise together, experiencing that object, but it's not the same quality, not the same reality; each one has its own characteristic.
Memory cannot feel, is there remembering? Yes, there is, and usually it's "I remember", but remembering is remembering, not anyone at all. That's why we learn about the truth, the hidden truth, which is covered by ignorance and attachment - the second Noble Truth, taking it instantly as something; how much ignorance is there? So, ignorance cannot understand the truth. That's why the understanding only can wear away ignorance and attachment, so very, very slightly, unknown. Isn't this the study of dhamma? Not just the word, the word is remembered, but when there is no understanding, how can that be the study of Dhamma? Just studying the word, remembering the word - not the understanding of Dhamma. That's why some people can have a degree, high degree in Pali or anything, but what about understanding the truth, and when and what and where is the truth? They cannot find out that.
For example, what is real, what is the truth of this moment? No idea. What is moment, and what is this moment, and what is the truth of this moment? No idea at all. Without listening to the words of the Buddha, can anyone have the understanding of each moment as it is, not permanent at all? As conditioned moment, conditioned reality, different realities - all gone. So, little by little, we'll come to understand what is meant by kamma and what is meant by vipaka; Not just the word, different words, but the reality, which is that which is the cause, kamma, and the result, vipaka. Just talking about the cause and vipaka, and it seems that there is the understanding of kamma and vipaka, but not at all. What is that reality which is kamma, and how can it be kamma, and what kind of kamma?
Now seeing is there, it sees - that's why it's real
So now, we don't talk about sankhara-khandha, we are talking about sankhara-dhamma, how careful it has to be. That's why if the understanding of sankhara-dhamma is not clear, it's mixed up with other words, other ideas; that's why we have to learn just one word at a time - dhamma is whatever is real. Why is it real? It's there, seeing, so seeing is real; seeing arises, otherwise there could be no seeing; learn little by little to have confidence of the truth - sacca-parami, it's so very important. That's why don't move on to other words, other chapters, so very rapidly, quickly - it doesn't have firm understanding of each word of truth.
So, when we talk about dhamma, we don't talk about other things, we just talk about dhamma. And when we talk about khandha, we talk about what khandha are. And sankhara-dhamma, visankhara-dhamma... just the word, but what are they? No answer because no understanding, but there can be the answer - all realities are dhamma, all dhammas - all - whatever arises is real and is conditioned, so, all kinds of dhamma which arises is sankhara-dhamma - just another word for dhamma. So, we weren't talking about sankhara-khandha, we were just talking about sankhara-dhamma; Otherwise, they are all mixed, isn't that true? [Yes, Ajahn.]
So, when there is the understanding of sankhara-dhamma, we can tell what sankhara-dhamma is not sankhara-khandha.
So, we learn another bit more about what is khandha. Is vedana-khandha dhamma? [Yes.]
Is vedana-khandha sankhara-dhamma? [Yes.]
That's why it has to be firm, understanding is understanding, it shouldn't be changed to - no understanding. That's why it's the way to prove how much understanding or how firm understanding of the truth is between the two words; it can prove how much confidence of the truth is there. What are sankhara-khandha, and what are sankhara-dhamma? So, first of all, sankhara-dhamma should be so firmly established - never change; sankhara-dhamma, whatever dhamma, whatever reality, whatever arises is sankhara-dhamma, because it needs conditions for its arising, and the conditions must be realities too - not other things.
For example, seeing, the eye is real, it's a dhamma. So, all are dhammas, whatever is real, are [is] dhamma. So, is the eye-base sankhara-khandha? [No, Ajahn.]
Is it sankhara-dhamma? [Yes.]
Understanding the difference between sankhara-dhamma and sankhara-khandha; but before we talk about sankhara-khandha, we should have firm understanding of sankhara-dhamma; no change, so no matter we talk by way of sankhara-khandha or dhatu and so on and on, no change of the truth, sankhara-dhamma is that which arises and falls away. And some are sankhara-khandha, and the next, very, very subtle, on and on and on, little by little; otherwise, it's not studying dhamma, it's just reading, remembering the word only; quite much different between remembering the word and understanding the truth of that reality.
Dhamma: as soon as it has arisen is gone: no conditions for it to last
So now, shall we review - what is dhamma? [dhamma is that which is real.]
Whatever is real; how do you know that it's real? [It's appearing now.]
It's there appearing, and later on we'll know that which does not appear is also dhamma. Little by little, but having firmer understanding about the truth; what is there had to arise, no matter it's experienced or not, but there must be conditions for whatever arises, whether it's experienced or not, including what is experienced and what is not experienced, but what arises has to have conditions for its arising. And they arise together too - nothing can arise alone, no matter what at all; firm confidence that we're talking about just one reality while there are other realities arising together, but since we cannot talk about all at once, so, we just talk about one kind of reality, to understand clearer and clearer about the truth - that nothing can be taken for someone or something at all because it's so short - as soon as it has arisen, it's gone instantly. And this is the world, and this is the truth of life, and this is the ultimate truth; eons and eons ago and on and on ahead, no one can change dhamma - dhamma is dhamma, and all dhammas are anatta; it cannot be anyone because it's conditioned to arise, as soon as it has arisen is gone, no more conditions to stay longer. That's why learning to understand that ignorance is there, so great, so enormous, that it hinders the truth of what is there, taking that which is not permanent for permanent. Nothing appears to arise and falling away now because ignorance cannot understand each different reality which arise and fall away.
Paramis - being true to the truth, courageous, patient
That's why there's the person who developed great paramis to enlighten the truth - the enlightenment, in your land; and spread and shared his understanding with the others, now throughout the world; and not just only this world, other worlds too, in his time; deva world or brahma world - the truth is the truth. So, be truthful to the truth, respect the truth because what the Buddha respected was the truth - no one can change the truth. So now, we learn to understand the hidden truth, it's been hidden for quite a long, long time, and now the word of truth is heard, but it's so subtle that it takes very careful considering, again and again and again.
We have talked a lot about dhamma and seeing, dhamma and whatever dhamma, kamma and vipaka and so on - not enough at all, as long as it's not directly experienced; kamma is a word, but what is the reality that word refers to? And vipaka - it's a word, but what is the reality which is vipaka? Not just the word translated, but the understanding of this moment - so deep; even about what we take for, or have heard about, kamma - it's there right now, but what it is it's not known, until we learn little by little to understand what is there, real; until we understand that realities are so very different, from time to time and only once in samsara - arisen and fallen away instantly. So, being true to the truth - sacca-parami; with viriya-parami - courageous; khanti-parami - patient, great patience.
To let go of ignorance and attachment which hinder the truth, hide the truth all the time, ignorance covers up the truth - now is arising and falling away, nothing is permanent. Can that be realized? [Yes.]
But not now, but by understanding. So, is understanding a reality, is it real? What kind of reality is it? [It is nama.]
Nama-dhamma, right? Is it citta? [Yes, Ajahn.]
No, citta does not understand the truth, it just experiences the object, never changes.
Avijja - experiencing the object with no-understanding
Is there understanding? [I don't understand the question.]
See - I don't understand, so there has to be understanding, right? That's why, not forgetting, that we are learning about the truth, understanding is not not-understanding, right? There are two kinds: not-understanding and understanding, what is real? [Both are real.]
Both, right, at moment of not-understanding it's not-understanding - a reality which does not understand, which cannot understand, which never understands; is it a reality? [Yes.]
What is there in life is a reality, complex, it never knows that what are there, since is not-understanding. It's a reality - ignorance, avijja; vijja is understanding, and a-vijja no-understanding, avijja, right? So, what kind of reality is it? [Nama-dhamma?] Sure? [Yes.]
Sure? [Yes, Ajahn.]
Sure? It's firm now, it's real - not understanding, not being able to understand - it's a reality, avijja; it's dhamma, it experiences the object with no-understanding; so, it's not citta, it's cetasika; and it is akusala cetasika. So, we learn to understand the cetasikas, because there are many cetasikas; each has its own quality, characteristic, function. So, all kinds of cetasika cannot be citta; citta is just the chief of experiencing, it does not like, it does not dislike, it does not understand, it doesn't anything, but it's that which experiences the object clearly, at any moment, since eons and eons ago. And it arises with different kinds of cetasikas; sometimes it arises with ignorance, avijja, and sometimes it arises with right understanding, pañña or vijja - no one.
That's why we just don't talk about kamma or vipaka, about the word, but what about the understanding, what is kamma, and what is vipaka - now, vipaka is also there, who knows? Learn to understand what is the cause, kamma, and what is the result, vipaka; and there are many, many realities too; more precise about each reality, not mixing it with the other. And this is the virtue, the great virtues of the Buddha; His great compassion - no one could understand the truth if He hadn't taught it, if He hadn't said anything about the truth at all: phra-pañña-khun, phra-borisut-khun, and phra-maha-karuna-khun - wisdom, compassion, and virtue. So now, you know who is Buddha; not just the one to just pay respect to, but understand His great virtues for anyone to have understanding; and understanding is pañña cetasika.
[Sukin:] And Prakash, can there be respect without understanding? [No, that's not the real respect.]
[A. Sujin:] So now, do you respect the Buddha? At moment of understanding. I appreciate your wholesome parami; sawadee ka.
Mp3 audio file: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1gDeDSAufK7RfTVkLazho7yGrFilyBK-0
#Dhammahome source video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJAP_ZSzzJ8